LINK to the WotC D&D 5e forum where this entire discussion is being held.

Hi,

I've been remembering my old 1e AD&D days, where gaining Ability Score increases were only rare [occurrences] of magic item or through Wish spells. I think the effect on the game was that one stopped worrying about what one didn't have and concentrated on how to maximise the strengths of the PC, as well as more lateral thinking about how to be better prepared for contingencies, as well as group dynamics (not to mention using 10' poles to check for traps).

Imagine, if you will, 5e without Ability Score boosts, and instead, every four levels being only Feats. Whatever one's stats are will be the way barring [generosity] of the GM in magic item selection, or luck of the dice on the MI lists granting Manuals of Gainful whatsit, or the like.

Everything else works the same as RAW 5e, just without the [escalation] of, 'I think it is more important to get your Stats to 20 as fast as possible.'

Sound interesting to any of the old timers? The OSR crowd? New D&D players?

--I think I'm going that route with my gaming group.

[snip]

Karnos wrote:

I hope you are prepared for a party of 5 wizards.

Weapon attacking classes are very [dependent] on main stat. For example, a fighter with 20 strength does an incredible double the damage of a fighter with 12 strength with a longsword.

Casters, not so much. While some features may allow them to add ability score bonus, and spell saves are based on casting ability score, a failed save often still does some damage and the overall effect of +5 damage on a 8d6 damage spell is very small compared to that same +5 damage when applied to a 1d8 damage attack.

[snip]

How many players who wanted to play anything but a Caster will go Caster simply [because] it makes more numerical sense for them to capitalise on the factors you have stated?

Very few, I think, but, I could be wrong. Funny, that. It was often said that Wizards or (Magic-Users in days of yore) completely out-performed Fighters at high levels, but the ironic thing about that was an all Wizard party likely never reached those levels due to only having d4 HD. ;) Once PF raised HD from d4s to d6, things got a little better, but then Sorcs got their d8s and the race was off to have Wizards compete in Melee [with] the d6-d8s and the Fighters then had to go Feat-happy to retain their edge, again. lol.

Part of the charm of Old School is that it is a long term play strategy with very little payoff at lower levels for even a 'balanced' party of the big 4 classes (wait, I hear old grognards complaining about the inclusion of d4 HD Thieves and d6 Clerics with a spell at 1st level!). It became/becomes a chess [game of] opportunities and unexpected increases of power when a rare spell (let alone magic item) came into the party's hands. Once a party started to include more than one of a the classes, or in AD&D, the sub-classes, then it got a little easier to pull things off.

I don't know of too many parties that cons[is]ted only of Assassins, Druids, Illusionists, and Barbarians, but, there were each of those accessorising Big 4 parties for added effectiveness.

It is a multi-piece machine that can be reconfigured in thousands of base ways, taken to exponential [manifestations] through Player styles and strategies. The obvious Power Gamer [strategies] in CharOp are the most superficial ones this game of ours offers.

Weekend 13-15 September

#dnd5e
#urutsk

Saturday: Played a 5e Paladin in a Freeport game.

Sunday: Urutsk (Vrun contintent): Had seven players, only got about an hour in, but that saw the Khark willingly go under Possession after learning that it is the Shorrannin who possess his people, not their Ancestors.  He was struck by the Yirinn Fighter who burnt 8 Blood to land a blow -- but the damage wasn't enough after halving to KO the Khark, who fled into the misty morning of hte spillway.  Before that, a Thronetree piloted by its unconscious captive (a new PC Khark Monk) appeared in the area, and threatened to damage the broad bridge.  The party all joined in to attack the thing, but its DR 5/- bark proved too tough to get a good feel for what it would do if it were not inanimate after teh Monk stopped piloting it.

Monday: Played my Fighter 1/Warlock 2, Hekaethra, and gathered a bunch of spell components (skeleton dust, witch dust, unnamed potions, holy water from a LN temple that also sells Unholy Water, Healing potions, and other stuff.  She is now sporting a black gryphon cloak, shield, and has 3 goblin daggers.  XP total so far: 1,200.